folsomppe
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Post by folsomppe on Oct 3, 2023 18:54:31 GMT -6
you are wrong about Kirk and his stats prove it, this year alone he is at the top of rating vs blitz. I don't think a sack against a blitz counts in the rating, it's only if a thrown ball is completed. Could be wrong on that though. I was at the USC v. ASU game two weeks ago and was not all that impressed with Williams. His deep ball touch was not good and when you have all day to throw the ball it tends to make the QB look better.
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Post by tavike on Oct 3, 2023 21:52:51 GMT -6
I don't think a sack against a blitz counts in the rating, it's only if a thrown ball is completed. Could be wrong on that though. PFF MIN Vikings @pff_Vikings · 4h Kirk Cousins vs the blitz this year 🟣 36/52 (69.2%) 🟣 357 passing yards 🟣 7 TDs (1st), 0 INTs 🟣 128.0 passer rating (2nd) So the stats are for only when the ball is thrown. Would be interesting to know how many sacks he's taken on blitzes.
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lunas
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Post by lunas on Oct 3, 2023 23:27:41 GMT -6
You have to take chances in the draft to land Mahomes, Burrow, Allen, Hebert, etc.
In a QB starved league called the NFL, where executive decision makers jobs are on the line hitching their careers to QB’s, finding a Super Bowl caliber QB via free agency or trade makes no logical sense.
Why would a team let a 28 year old like Sam Bradford and Kirk Cousins walk? Because they lack an intangible that is needed to win games that count. That, coupled with their high salaries literally handcuffs their ballclub in the amount of high level talent that is needed to be kept and acquired for them to win.
It’s a losing formula. The odds are against you with type of roster construction.
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Post by drhoades on Oct 3, 2023 23:56:20 GMT -6
You have to take chances in the draft to land Mahomes, Burrow, Allen, Hebert, etc. In a QB starved league called the NFL, where executive decision makers jobs are on the line hitching their careers to QB’s, finding a Super Bowl caliber QB via free agency or trade makes no logical sense. Why would a team let a 28 year old like Sam Bradford and Kirk Cousins walk? Because they lack an intangible that is needed to win games that count. That, coupled with their high salaries literally handcuffs their ballclub in the amount of high level talent that is needed to be kept and acquired for them to win. It’s a losing formula. The odds are against you with type of roster construction. Ya and the odds are with you dumping a top 10 QB for a roll at the craps table lol
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Post by 1angryviking on Oct 4, 2023 6:26:17 GMT -6
You have to take chances in the draft to land Mahomes, Burrow, Allen, Hebert, etc. In a QB starved league called the NFL, where executive decision makers jobs are on the line hitching their careers to QB’s, finding a Super Bowl caliber QB via free agency or trade makes no logical sense. Why would a team let a 28 year old like Sam Bradford and Kirk Cousins walk? Because they lack an intangible that is needed to win games that count. That, coupled with their high salaries literally handcuffs their ballclub in the amount of high level talent that is needed to be kept and acquired for them to win. It’s a losing formula. The odds are against you with type of roster construction. Ya and the odds are with you dumping a top 10 QB for a roll at the craps table lol “Top 10 QB’s” know when to clock the ball.
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Post by dougpaschal on Oct 4, 2023 8:26:05 GMT -6
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lunas
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Post by lunas on Oct 4, 2023 9:14:53 GMT -6
You have to take chances in the draft to land Mahomes, Burrow, Allen, Hebert, etc. In a QB starved league called the NFL, where executive decision makers jobs are on the line hitching their careers to QB’s, finding a Super Bowl caliber QB via free agency or trade makes no logical sense. Why would a team let a 28 year old like Sam Bradford and Kirk Cousins walk? Because they lack an intangible that is needed to win games that count. That, coupled with their high salaries literally handcuffs their ballclub in the amount of high level talent that is needed to be kept and acquired for them to win. It’s a losing formula. The odds are against you with type of roster construction. Ya and the odds are with you dumping a top 10 QB for a roll at the craps table lol If going 9-8 or 10-7 and getting bounced from the playoffs for 60+ years makes you happy, then you obviously have the same philosophy as the Wilf’s. I would rather take a chance to be the best and potentially suffer the consequences of being terrible for awhile to get there. That was apparently Poles’ philosophy which is why he left without a contract. A lot of people are happy to live average lives. Absolutely nothing wrong with that. Just don’t complain and be envious of people that are hoisting Lombardi’s.
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shawn3458
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Post by shawn3458 on Oct 4, 2023 9:31:32 GMT -6
I don't think a sack against a blitz counts in the rating, it's only if a thrown ball is completed. Could be wrong on that though. I was at the USC v. ASU game two weeks ago and was not all that impressed with Williams. His deep ball touch was not good and when you have all day to throw the ball it tends to make the QB look better. I see Williams a bit like Justin Fields at OSU. The o-line was/is pretty darn good and may be masking some deficiencies Williams may have. I think he is definitely a top prospect, but people need to pump the brakes. I actually feel better about a couple other QBs pro potential than Williams right now.
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shawn3458
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Post by shawn3458 on Oct 4, 2023 9:35:07 GMT -6
Ya and the odds are with you dumping a top 10 QB for a roll at the craps table lol If going 9-8 or 10-7 and getting bounced from the playoffs for 60+ years makes you happy, then you obviously have the same philosophy as the Wilf’s. I would rather take a chance to be the best and potentially suffer the consequences of being terrible for awhile to get there. That was apparently Poles’ philosophy which is why he left without a contract. A lot of people are happy to live average lives. Absolutely nothing wrong with that. Just don’t complain and be envious of people that are hoisting Lombardi’s. As much as I like seeing the Vikes be competitive year after year, I have to agree with Lunas here. And let’s not pretend they haven’t had a couple dogshit seasons anyway.
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Post by drhoades on Oct 4, 2023 9:53:49 GMT -6
Ya and the odds are with you dumping a top 10 QB for a roll at the craps table lol “Top 10 QB’s” know when to clock the ball. KOC didnt want him to clock the ball, he wanted to get tricky.
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Post by drhoades on Oct 4, 2023 9:55:04 GMT -6
If going 9-8 or 10-7 and getting bounced from the playoffs for 60+ years makes you happy, then you obviously have the same philosophy as the Wilf’s. I would rather take a chance to be the best and potentially suffer the consequences of being terrible for awhile to get there. That was apparently Poles’ philosophy which is why he left without a contract. A lot of people are happy to live average lives. Absolutely nothing wrong with that. Just don’t complain and be envious of people that are hoisting Lombardi’s. As much as I like seeing the Vikes be competitive year after year, I have to agree with Lunas here. And let’s not pretend they haven’t had a couple dogshit seasons anyway. just saying, we were talking odds, and the odds prove out, tanking for a QB in the crapshoot are not good at all
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Post by redbird87 on Oct 4, 2023 10:00:38 GMT -6
Ya and the odds are with you dumping a top 10 QB for a roll at the craps table lol If going 9-8 or 10-7 and getting bounced from the playoffs for 60+ years makes you happy, then you obviously have the same philosophy as the Wilf’s. I would rather take a chance to be the best and potentially suffer the consequences of being terrible for awhile to get there. That was apparently Poles’ philosophy which is why he left without a contract. A lot of people are happy to live average lives. Absolutely nothing wrong with that. Just don’t complain and be envious of people that are hoisting Lombardi’s. Last I checked we've drafted a lot of QB's in that window and the results haven't been any different than the FA's QB's we've acquired. What most people fail to realize is getting a franchise QB is mostly luck....particularly in this day and age when college football doesn't really translate to the next level.
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Post by franklin99 on Oct 4, 2023 10:08:15 GMT -6
With the Vikings scouting staff? Yes, it is 100% luck. Sincerely, The Hijacker
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Post by 1angryviking on Oct 4, 2023 10:10:38 GMT -6
“Top 10 QB’s” know when to clock the ball. KOC didnt want him to clock the ball, he wanted to get tricky. A top 10 QB knows when to clock the ball
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Post by redbird87 on Oct 4, 2023 11:15:22 GMT -6
No players in college football are watched and scouted more closely than QB's and yet the success rate is roughly 10%. What that should tell you is that getting a franchise QB is more about luck than skill...particularly in today's NFL where college offenses don't translate. The most hyped QB's either play on offenses that are gimmicks, so far above and beyond the competitions defenses that they are rarely pressured and asked to go through progressions or they are from smaller programs where it's impossible to know if the success they are having can translate against better competition in the NFL (think Purdy). QB success is dependent on much more than the player alone. Not only do you have to draft the right guy, but now you have to hope you are putting them in a position to succeed. Are you going to put too much pressure on him early. Is your line strong enough to protect him so he doesn't get rattled and spooked from enduring constant hits, can your coaching staff work to his strengths, is the rest of the team strong enough win helping to build confidence. Does anyone here actually think Patrick Mahomes would be the Patrick Mahomes everyone is drooling over if the Vikings had drafted him instead of KC? 100% no way! We had OC's that ran a specific offense that would not have adapted to his skillset. Zimmer would have gone nuts with his adlib nature....anyone remember how much he hated Case Keenum? And our OL would have had him running for his life because he isn't really a timing QB. I'm not saying he'd have been a failure, but he's probably not the superstar everyone knows today.
And as to the whole "tired of being content with being good" have to draft a QB. 1st, getting to a super bowls starts with being good. Then you have to have a lot of things go right. You have to have good coaching, you have to stay healthy, you need you have a schedule that is favorable, you have to get some calls that go your way at the right times, you have to have the ball bounce your way and your team needs to gel....but if your team isn't at least in a position to be competetive...none of the rest matters. It starts with putting a team that can win on the field....we have that team, Chicago does not. And for the poster that constantly talks about have to draft a QB, that going the FA route over and over has to change....I'll remind you that Fran Tarkenton, Randall Cunningham, Brett Farve and Case Keenum got us closer to Super Bowl Victories than any QB we have ever drafted....and we've drafted a lot! Speaking of drafting a lot of QB's take a look at Cleveland.....how many 1st Round QB's have they drafted the last 30 years and how many SB appearances have they had?
Last, even if we are lucky enough to actually draft a "Franchise QB"....it doesn't guarantee success. Nick Foles and Mathew Stafford (who Detroit gave up on) have as many Super Bowl Rings and appearances as Aaron Rodgers and Drew Brees. They have more Super Bowl Rings that Joe Burrow, Jim Kelly, Dan Marino, Cam Newton, Matt Ryan, Steve McNair. And, they have more Super Bowl appearances than Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson, Dak Prescott, Andrew Luck, Tony Romo, Dan Marino, Phillip Rivers, Dan Fouts, Warren Moon ......... all Franchise QB's and many who are in or on their way to the HOF!
The obsession with betting the farm on a QB is just mind blowing. In my opinion, build a team that has a respectable Defense in place, has an OL that can protect a QB and then go draft your QB. I have no problem with drafting but do so when they are in a position to succeed and don't bet the farm for one...that backdrop is not the 2024 Vikings!
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