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Post by Vikeroo on Apr 20, 2023 15:27:10 GMT -6
It is because a Lance to Minnesota and Kirk to 49ers makes a lot of sense is why there are rumors. Which is the Daunte Debate. Downgrading the QB position with ideas that are dumb. It is called the start over plan. Take a look at a younger guy and be ready to draft one next year. It is one of the few places Kirk would agree to be traded to. Also are you sure it would be a downgrade at QB? |
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Post by redbird87 on Apr 20, 2023 16:08:18 GMT -6
I've been trying to talk about this for the last week or so, but I think there is some real life to this rumour. I know everyone on this board is looking at it from the context of the Vikings, but what I've been arguing is this makes almost more sense for the 49s than the Vikings. "IF" the Vikings have determined they do not want to extend Kirk then this is probably "THE" best outcome and a WIN WIN for both teams. The only thing keeping the 49s from dominating the league the past few years has been QB play because they can't keep anyone healthy! Purdy may not play a snap in 23, Darnald isn't going to get the job done and Lance is a wildcard...I don't think the 49's really know what they do or don't have there. If they play him and he gets hurt they are doomed, if they play him and he stinks they are doomed AND they won't get much if anything for him in trade with a higher price tag in year 4. Trading for Kirk makes all the sense in the world if you are the 49's. You have Kirk for 1 year, he knows your offense, historically is extremely durable, he's accurate an efficient and would immediately elevate the 49's into the best team in the NFC if not the NFL. If it doesn't pan out, you let him walk and Purdy comes back in 24!
For the Vikings, they get a one year trial on a young QB without having to give up high draft capital to get him. In fact, I think the Vikings may actually get some draft capital or another player back in return because there are a lot of ?'s surrounding his abilities to play and stay healthy. For the Vikings they get a QB that at a minimum has some familiarity with what it's like to be a pro, and if it pans out you get your future franchise QB who is only 23 and you didn't have to give up any pics to get him. You essentially got him for the cost of a player you intended to let walk without any compensation.
This particular draft class isn't jumping off the page with sure fire talents, so if you are the Vikings ... why not explore an option that allows you to take a swing at a QB that has as much upside as every other QB in this class while keeping all of your draft pics. And for 49's, if your window is closing...why not take a shot at high quality veteran that solidifies the one position that has held you back, while knowing that you aren't tied into a high contract long term and still have a young QB in Purdy you have confidence in who can take back over in 24.
It's rare that a situation fits this well for both teams. SF would have to create some cap space....but that is doable and the Vikings could even eat some cap if they needed to make the deal workable. Only downside to the Vikings is you'd be making your road to the SB harder for 1 year.
I'd still prefer to extend Cousins....I think he's playing the best ball of his career, I think the Hurts deal should indicate his willingness to extend under 40M is a bargain and he appears to have a lot of gas left in the tank. I'm not opposed to moving on....but if we are.....taking a chance on Lance with draft cost to try sure does seem to make more sense than using multiple picks of draft capital on a guy that has a 90% chance of failing when you have a ton of needs elsewhere on Defense!
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Post by Vikeroo on Apr 20, 2023 17:56:42 GMT -6
I've been trying to talk about this for the last week or so, but I think there is some real life to this rumour. I know everyone on this board is looking at it from the context of the Vikings, but what I've been arguing is this makes almost more sense for the 49s than the Vikings. "IF" the Vikings have determined they do not want to extend Kirk then this is probably "THE" best outcome and a WIN WIN for both teams. The only thing keeping the 49s from dominating the league the past few years has been QB play because they can't keep anyone healthy! Purdy may not play a snap in 23, Darnald isn't going to get the job done and Lance is a wildcard...I don't think the 49's really know what they do or don't have there. If they play him and he gets hurt they are doomed, if they play him and he stinks they are doomed AND they won't get much if anything for him in trade with a higher price tag in year 4. Trading for Kirk makes all the sense in the world if you are the 49's. You have Kirk for 1 year, he knows your offense, historically is extremely durable, he's accurate an efficient and would immediately elevate the 49's into the best team in the NFC if not the NFL. If it doesn't pan out, you let him walk and Purdy comes back in 24! For the Vikings, they get a one year trial on a young QB without having to give up high draft capital to get him. In fact, I think the Vikings may actually get some draft capital or another player back in return because there are a lot of ?'s surrounding his abilities to play and stay healthy. For the Vikings they get a QB that at a minimum has some familiarity with what it's like to be a pro, and if it pans out you get your future franchise QB who is only 23 and you didn't have to give up any pics to get him. You essentially got him for the cost of a player you intended to let walk without any compensation. This particular draft class isn't jumping off the page with sure fire talents, so if you are the Vikings ... why not explore an option that allows you to take a swing at a QB that has as much upside as every other QB in this class while keeping all of your draft pics. And for 49's, if your window is closing...why not take a shot at high quality veteran that solidifies the one position that has held you back, while knowing that you aren't tied into a high contract long term and still have a young QB in Purdy you have confidence in who can take back over in 24. It's rare that a situation fits this well for both teams. SF would have to create some cap space....but that is doable and the Vikings could even eat some cap if they needed to make the deal workable. Only downside to the Vikings is you'd be making your road to the SB harder for 1 year. I'd still prefer to extend Cousins....I think he's playing the best ball of his career, I think the Hurts deal should indicate his willingness to extend under 40M is a bargain and he appears to have a lot of gas left in the tank. I'm not opposed to moving on....but if we are.....taking a chance on Lance with draft cost to try sure does seem to make more sense than using multiple picks of draft capital on a guy that has a 90% chance of failing when you have a ton of needs elsewhere on Defense! Drop the last paragraph and I am 100% with you. |
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Post by 2012mom on Apr 20, 2023 18:54:58 GMT -6
I've been trying to talk about this for the last week or so, but I think there is some real life to this rumour. I know everyone on this board is looking at it from the context of the Vikings, but what I've been arguing is this makes almost more sense for the 49s than the Vikings. "IF" the Vikings have determined they do not want to extend Kirk then this is probably "THE" best outcome and a WIN WIN for both teams. The only thing keeping the 49s from dominating the league the past few years has been QB play because they can't keep anyone healthy! Purdy may not play a snap in 23, Darnald isn't going to get the job done and Lance is a wildcard...I don't think the 49's really know what they do or don't have there. If they play him and he gets hurt they are doomed, if they play him and he stinks they are doomed AND they won't get much if anything for him in trade with a higher price tag in year 4. Trading for Kirk makes all the sense in the world if you are the 49's. You have Kirk for 1 year, he knows your offense, historically is extremely durable, he's accurate an efficient and would immediately elevate the 49's into the best team in the NFC if not the NFL. If it doesn't pan out, you let him walk and Purdy comes back in 24! For the Vikings, they get a one year trial on a young QB without having to give up high draft capital to get him. In fact, I think the Vikings may actually get some draft capital or another player back in return because there are a lot of ?'s surrounding his abilities to play and stay healthy. For the Vikings they get a QB that at a minimum has some familiarity with what it's like to be a pro, and if it pans out you get your future franchise QB who is only 23 and you didn't have to give up any pics to get him. You essentially got him for the cost of a player you intended to let walk without any compensation. This particular draft class isn't jumping off the page with sure fire talents, so if you are the Vikings ... why not explore an option that allows you to take a swing at a QB that has as much upside as every other QB in this class while keeping all of your draft pics. And for 49's, if your window is closing...why not take a shot at high quality veteran that solidifies the one position that has held you back, while knowing that you aren't tied into a high contract long term and still have a young QB in Purdy you have confidence in who can take back over in 24. It's rare that a situation fits this well for both teams. SF would have to create some cap space....but that is doable and the Vikings could even eat some cap if they needed to make the deal workable. Only downside to the Vikings is you'd be making your road to the SB harder for 1 year. I'd still prefer to extend Cousins....I think he's playing the best ball of his career, I think the Hurts deal should indicate his willingness to extend under 40M is a bargain and he appears to have a lot of gas left in the tank. I'm not opposed to moving on....but if we are.....taking a chance on Lance with draft cost to try sure does seem to make more sense than using multiple picks of draft capital on a guy that has a 90% chance of failing when you have a ton of needs elsewhere on Defense! My main problem with your scenario is that I don't think that Lance is a NFL starting QB. He hadn't shown in his few starts nearly as much as Purdy did before his injury, and if Lance would come here, the Vikings would get only one season before having to decide whether or not to pick up his 5th year option. He will come into 2023 with very few games played over the past several years, which is particularly bad for a guy who was considered "raw" coming out of college. |
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Post by Vikeroo on Apr 20, 2023 19:53:21 GMT -6
I've been trying to talk about this for the last week or so, but I think there is some real life to this rumour. I know everyone on this board is looking at it from the context of the Vikings, but what I've been arguing is this makes almost more sense for the 49s than the Vikings. "IF" the Vikings have determined they do not want to extend Kirk then this is probably "THE" best outcome and a WIN WIN for both teams. The only thing keeping the 49s from dominating the league the past few years has been QB play because they can't keep anyone healthy! Purdy may not play a snap in 23, Darnald isn't going to get the job done and Lance is a wildcard...I don't think the 49's really know what they do or don't have there. If they play him and he gets hurt they are doomed, if they play him and he stinks they are doomed AND they won't get much if anything for him in trade with a higher price tag in year 4. Trading for Kirk makes all the sense in the world if you are the 49's. You have Kirk for 1 year, he knows your offense, historically is extremely durable, he's accurate an efficient and would immediately elevate the 49's into the best team in the NFC if not the NFL. If it doesn't pan out, you let him walk and Purdy comes back in 24! For the Vikings, they get a one year trial on a young QB without having to give up high draft capital to get him. In fact, I think the Vikings may actually get some draft capital or another player back in return because there are a lot of ?'s surrounding his abilities to play and stay healthy. For the Vikings they get a QB that at a minimum has some familiarity with what it's like to be a pro, and if it pans out you get your future franchise QB who is only 23 and you didn't have to give up any pics to get him. You essentially got him for the cost of a player you intended to let walk without any compensation. This particular draft class isn't jumping off the page with sure fire talents, so if you are the Vikings ... why not explore an option that allows you to take a swing at a QB that has as much upside as every other QB in this class while keeping all of your draft pics. And for 49's, if your window is closing...why not take a shot at high quality veteran that solidifies the one position that has held you back, while knowing that you aren't tied into a high contract long term and still have a young QB in Purdy you have confidence in who can take back over in 24. It's rare that a situation fits this well for both teams. SF would have to create some cap space....but that is doable and the Vikings could even eat some cap if they needed to make the deal workable. Only downside to the Vikings is you'd be making your road to the SB harder for 1 year. I'd still prefer to extend Cousins....I think he's playing the best ball of his career, I think the Hurts deal should indicate his willingness to extend under 40M is a bargain and he appears to have a lot of gas left in the tank. I'm not opposed to moving on....but if we are.....taking a chance on Lance with draft cost to try sure does seem to make more sense than using multiple picks of draft capital on a guy that has a 90% chance of failing when you have a ton of needs elsewhere on Defense! My main problem with your scenario is that I don't think that Lance is a NFL starting QB. He hadn't shown in his few starts nearly as much as Purdy did before his injury, and if Lance would come here, the Vikings would get only one season before having to decide whether or not to pick up his 5th year option. He will come into 2023 with very few games played over the past several years, which is particularly bad for a guy who was considered "raw" coming out of college. He is younger then Hooker and Levis, right? |
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Post by 2012mom on Apr 20, 2023 21:21:17 GMT -6
My main problem with your scenario is that I don't think that Lance is a NFL starting QB. He hadn't shown in his few starts nearly as much as Purdy did before his injury, and if Lance would come here, the Vikings would get only one season before having to decide whether or not to pick up his 5th year option. He will come into 2023 with very few games played over the past several years, which is particularly bad for a guy who was considered "raw" coming out of college. He is younger then Hooker and Levis, right? Sure, but who cares? Those guys aren't going to fall to 23. But for the sake of discussion, either of those guys would be on cheap contacts for multiple years, and they've played against the best collegiate defenses for multiple years. Lance has barely played in the past few years, and he looked like chicken shit when he was handed the reins last year in SFO. Now, having had two surgeries to repair his ankle, there's a question about how his mobility could be affected. And I have to say that I was opposed to Lance before he was even drafted. I thought that SFO was crazy to give up multiple top picks to get a less capable Carson Wentz. |
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Post by comet52 on Apr 21, 2023 7:14:09 GMT -6
See Proud, you killed the b.s. and it came roaring back like a zombie. Every board I read has a lengthy, nauseating Trey Lance thread.
Trey Lance is hot garbage. The Vikings aren't trading Kirk for him. The Niners are fueling the "hot rumors" because they stepped in shit and now wish some sucker g.m. might give them something for their waste of draft capital.
Imagine fleecing the Vikings for Kirk in exchange for a pile of manure. They would crack open the most expensive bottle of champagne in the most expensive restaurant in San Fran and celebrate laughing out loud at our stupidity if they pulled that off. The message boards are full of guys who think Kwesi should volunteer to be that sucker. Rinse repeat.
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Post by blackmagic7 on Apr 21, 2023 8:39:49 GMT -6
The kicker for me man is that the 49ers "want" to move on from him.
Our offer should reflect offers we receive for Dalvin. 49er fans should be seeking out a message board desperate to understand why their team didn't accept the 6th rounder they were offered.
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Post by redbird87 on Apr 21, 2023 8:55:39 GMT -6
The point is every QB in this draft has huge ? around them. As for your analysis that Lance looked like garbage in the 2 games he played....how many Young QB's take the world by storm in their first 2 games starting?? I'm not saying he is or isn't good.....I'm saying he's younger than most of the QB's in this draft and has literally about the same amount of experience as an NFL QB despite going into year 3. How did Laurence look his first year in the league? How did Hurts look in his first year? We all know Lance is raw and he wasn't drafted because they thought he'd look great day 1, they drafted him where they did because the thought he had a high ceiling. Do you honestly think AR or Hooker are going to look great in their first 2 starts in the NFL??
The argument is the Vikings get a shot seeing what this kid can do for 1 year and if he can make the strides everyone hopes he can make. If he does great....you got your future QB for the cost of a player you planned to let walk. If he doesn't you aren't stuck with a high priced rookie for the next 4 years that sucks and cost you a first or multiple firsts to get and you draft a QB in 24 which appears to be a much better QB class.
If we had Kirk under contract for the next 4 years, were comfortable with that and decided to trade him for Lance then that would be a questionable move. But if you are resigned to letting him walk at the end of this year for no compensation then I see this as the best alternative unless the Vikings feel Lance has no upside.
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Post by redbird87 on Apr 21, 2023 9:25:05 GMT -6
The kicker for me man is that the 49ers "want" to move on from him. Our offer should reflect offers we receive for Dalvin. 49er fans should be seeking out a message board desperate to understand why their team didn't accept the 6th rounder they were offered. I think their willingness to move him has more to do with their comfort level with Purdy. While not spectacular, Purdy was extremely efficient running their offense and costs them roughly 3M in total over the next 3 years. Lance is going to cost them 20M over the next 2. If you think Purdy can be extremely effective then the cost savings between the two makes Lance expendable. As to 23 specifically....I'm guessing the the 49rs know their window is open and while they need a QB due to Purdy rehabbing, they have more to lose then gain by NOT moving Lance now "IF" they can secure a talented veteran to run their offense. I think at this stage it is more about known vs. unknown commodities and $. And in the end...they may just roll with him....but I can completely understand why the Lance to Minnesota talk is buzzing because it potentially makes a lot of sense for both teams. I wouldn't be as big a fan if the plan is to trade for him AND keep Kirk. If you were going that route....I'd probably rather draft a QB! |
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Post by 2012mom on Apr 21, 2023 9:53:45 GMT -6
The kicker for me man is that the 49ers "want" to move on from him. Our offer should reflect offers we receive for Dalvin. 49er fans should be seeking out a message board desperate to understand why their team didn't accept the 6th rounder they were offered. I think their willingness to move him has more to do with their comfort level with Purdy. While not spectacular, Purdy was extremely efficient running their offense and costs them roughly 3M in total over the next 3 years. Lance is going to cost them 20M over the next 2. If you think Purdy can be extremely effective then the cost savings between the two makes Lance expendable. As to 23 specifically....I'm guessing the the 49rs know their window is open and while they need a QB due to Purdy rehabbing, they have more to lose then gain by NOT moving Lance now "IF" they can secure a talented veteran to run their offense. I think at this stage it is more about known vs. unknown commodities and $. And in the end...they may just roll with him....but I can completely understand why the Lance to Minnesota talk is buzzing because it potentially makes a lot of sense for both teams. I wouldn't be as big a fan if the plan is to trade for him AND keep Kirk. If you were going that route....I'd probably rather draft a QB! You answered your own question: Purdy looked excellent in his first two starts. SFO knows more about Lance than anyone at this point, and (assuming it's true that they're trying to trade him), they believe that Lance's ceiling is lower than the "less than spectacular" Purdy. Now, that may be because they think Purdy is the second coming of Tom Brady, in which case Lance may "only" be another Steve Young, but it may also be that Purdy is more like Kirk Cousins, and Trey Lance is another Joe Webb. I'm seeing Trey Lance as a lot closer to Joe Webb than to Steve Young. |
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Post by bigbone62 on Apr 21, 2023 10:44:17 GMT -6
I think their willingness to move him has more to do with their comfort level with Purdy. While not spectacular, Purdy was extremely efficient running their offense and costs them roughly 3M in total over the next 3 years. Lance is going to cost them 20M over the next 2. If you think Purdy can be extremely effective then the cost savings between the two makes Lance expendable. As to 23 specifically....I'm guessing the the 49rs know their window is open and while they need a QB due to Purdy rehabbing, they have more to lose then gain by NOT moving Lance now "IF" they can secure a talented veteran to run their offense. I think at this stage it is more about known vs. unknown commodities and $. And in the end...they may just roll with him....but I can completely understand why the Lance to Minnesota talk is buzzing because it potentially makes a lot of sense for both teams. I wouldn't be as big a fan if the plan is to trade for him AND keep Kirk. If you were going that route....I'd probably rather draft a QB! You answered your own question: Purdy looked excellent in his first two starts. SFO knows more about Lance than anyone at this point, and (assuming it's true that they're trying to trade him), they believe that Lance's ceiling is lower than the "less than spectacular" Purdy. Now, that may be because they think Purdy is the second coming of Tom Brady, in which case Lance may "only" be another Steve Young, but it may also be that Purdy is more like Kirk Cousins, and Trey Lance is another Joe Webb. I'm seeing Trey Lance as a lot closer to Joe Webb than to Steve Young. Exactly! There are way more questions as to why is he on the trade market than there are answers for why there should be teams lining up to get him. A GM widely praised around the league for building an exceptional team via the draft is looking to move a QB he gave up 3 first round picks and 1 third round pick to get, just two seasons ago. Why would the niners make that trade unless someone offers something stupid? Something stupid starts with recouping a first-round pick. A head coach widely praised as an offensive guru is looking to pivot from said QB after he’s made just 4 starts. And largely based on 8 starts from another young QB. A QB likely to miss most of, if not the entire season. A combined cap of just over $15 million for the 3 QB's currently on the roster. So, it’s not a money issue. For that little tied up in the cap and massive questions about Purdy why dump Lance now? The team was so worried about Lance that they gave serious thought to hiring the QB guru they sent him to both off-season's. A guru who had no NFL coaching experience, as their QB coach. Windows to win in the NFL are increasingly small and SF is built to win. Rolling into 2023 with Sam Darnold as the guy taking most of the snaps. God knows who as the backup. While gambling the season on a QB with 8 starts coming off a major injury to maintain their level of play last year, doesn't reek of win now. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2023 11:25:37 GMT -6
I've been trying to talk about this for the last week or so, but I think there is some real life to this rumour. I know everyone on this board is looking at it from the context of the Vikings, but what I've been arguing is this makes almost more sense for the 49s than the Vikings. "IF" the Vikings have determined they do not want to extend Kirk then this is probably "THE" best outcome and a WIN WIN for both teams. The only thing keeping the 49s from dominating the league the past few years has been QB play because they can't keep anyone healthy! Purdy may not play a snap in 23, Darnald isn't going to get the job done and Lance is a wildcard...I don't think the 49's really know what they do or don't have there. If they play him and he gets hurt they are doomed, if they play him and he stinks they are doomed AND they won't get much if anything for him in trade with a higher price tag in year 4. Trading for Kirk makes all the sense in the world if you are the 49's. You have Kirk for 1 year, he knows your offense, historically is extremely durable, he's accurate an efficient and would immediately elevate the 49's into the best team in the NFC if not the NFL. If it doesn't pan out, you let him walk and Purdy comes back in 24! For the Vikings, they get a one year trial on a young QB without having to give up high draft capital to get him. In fact, I think the Vikings may actually get some draft capital or another player back in return because there are a lot of ?'s surrounding his abilities to play and stay healthy. For the Vikings they get a QB that at a minimum has some familiarity with what it's like to be a pro, and if it pans out you get your future franchise QB who is only 23 and you didn't have to give up any pics to get him. You essentially got him for the cost of a player you intended to let walk without any compensation. This particular draft class isn't jumping off the page with sure fire talents, so if you are the Vikings ... why not explore an option that allows you to take a swing at a QB that has as much upside as every other QB in this class while keeping all of your draft pics. And for 49's, if your window is closing...why not take a shot at high quality veteran that solidifies the one position that has held you back, while knowing that you aren't tied into a high contract long term and still have a young QB in Purdy you have confidence in who can take back over in 24. It's rare that a situation fits this well for both teams. SF would have to create some cap space....but that is doable and the Vikings could even eat some cap if they needed to make the deal workable. Only downside to the Vikings is you'd be making your road to the SB harder for 1 year. I'd still prefer to extend Cousins....I think he's playing the best ball of his career, I think the Hurts deal should indicate his willingness to extend under 40M is a bargain and he appears to have a lot of gas left in the tank. I'm not opposed to moving on....but if we are.....taking a chance on Lance with draft cost to try sure does seem to make more sense than using multiple picks of draft capital on a guy that has a 90% chance of failing when you have a ton of needs elsewhere on Defense! I don't see the Vikings' alleged interest in Lance as being a QB-for-QB swap. That would almost assume a year of tanking, and the Vikings otherwise do not show much interest in tanking. I think it only makes sense as Lance being insurance and possible future replacement, where you park him behind KC for a year. |
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taz24
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Post by taz24 on Apr 21, 2023 11:31:44 GMT -6
Lance is 22
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Post by Prටudhටrn on Apr 21, 2023 11:38:24 GMT -6
So is Chloë Grace Moretz. |
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